Transcript: Breaking Into Product: Internal Mobility vs. Switching Companies

Host: Eyal David · Guest: Moti Peretz · Back to episode

Moti Peretz talks about the X factor needed to break into a product manager role. He describes two paths — internal mobility within the company versus moving to a new company — and the insight that, as early as the first interview, you need to put on the table that you want to be in product. A short, bottom-line episode from Product Builder.

In this episode

  • The path with the highest chance of success in breaking into product is to make the change within the company you already work at — the company also has a strong interest in you succeeding.
  • Internal mobility into a product role requires patience and perseverance — it doesn't always happen quickly.
  • When you can't move internally (for example, a role that would only open up in another 4–5 years), it's better to look for a new company and declare your aspiration up front.
  • As early as the first interview, you should put on the table that you want to be in product; some companies won't like it — but some will see it as high motivation and give you a chance.
  • You need to know how to 'read the room' and the atmosphere to understand when and how to declare your aspiration.

Eyal David: [00:00] I was surprised — I came from an approach that's also what you started telling me: yes, internal mobility, moving within the company. Join the company, make your way through, actually get to product after a while, and then declare to everyone that this is what you want to do. That's the way — and that's also what I did, and probably many good people too. You're talking about entering, essentially—

Moti Peretz: [00:19] —as a junior into a product role, right. The first thing — that's also what I did, meaning I made the change within the company. And if you ask me today, and if someone comes to consult with me— —then without a doubt the best way, and I also think the best chance to succeed, is to make the change within the company, because the company also has a very high interest in you succeeding. That said, over the years— I started in a PM role, and then a lot started coming in too. Thank you, please. You didn't mention it — as happens to many, right — and over the years I helped, I helped teach and I learned through them, as we said, that you can do it, but it's a bit, it's a bit — it does require patience and perseverance. Now— Okay, so I can't make this change within my own company — that's what happened to me. Meaning, I was at Impro, and one fine day I discovered there's this role called product manager. It was different from today, there were fewer— —up front, but I discovered there's such a role. Okay, how do I get there? And it was very clear that there it wasn't going to happen in a— —what should I say — quick way. Meaning, there it was a role that usually, after a team-lead role like that, I'm not going to wait 4–5 years now for it to happen. So I started looking. It was a bit of a long shot. At one point I sat with a close friend who already had a lot more mileage than me — I'd come as a programmer from the army — and he said to me: listen, Moti, forget it, just go to some company, do what they tell you— —but say that it's on the table that you want to be in product. That's exactly what I did, and that's how I got to Trax. I was there to develop, and very quickly the company was in hypergrowth throughout the three and a half years I was there, and that also helped me grow a lot. But it was on the table from the very first moment — this is what I want to be. And I think that can really, really help people. Now they'll tell me— there are companies that won't like this. Read the room, read the atmosphere. I'm saying: come to the first interview and say it — it needs to be on the table. And some companies won't like it, but some companies, if not, will say: wow, here's someone with really high motivation. Let's bring him in, he'll really want to succeed, he'll want to push himself. That way I also gained someone brilliant — now for customer success, not product.

Eyal David: [02:50] This was a bottom-line ("takhles") episode from Product Builder. Want to hear the full conversation? Search for it in the feed, and don't forget to follow us.